posted
I was reading posts on another forum about DSL. What is a TXNU? Is that a type of circuit? Also does anyone have a list of circuit ID's such as for Hi-Cap or ISDN? Thanks, Jeff
-------------------- Jeff Moss Sole Proprietor Moss Communications "Your Residential Connection" Computer Repair-Networking-Cabling www.mosscomm.net MBSWWYPBX, JGAE Posts: 4973 | From: Beachwood and Toledo, OH | Registered: Dec 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Jeff those are called NCI codes, or common language codes. Might do a search and find them in google, also the station end is the secondary NCI codes.
-------------------- Located in the Nebraska Panhandle Posts: 10171 | From: Western Nebraska | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged |
From what I have seen around here, at least with Bell companies, the circuit ID format is as follows:
AABBBBCCCCCC.D.E(E)
AA= the last two digits of the LATA
BBBB= the circuit type i.e: IBZD is for a BRI, HCGS is for a T1, TKNA is a copper loop-start trunk, etc.
CCCCCCC= the actual circuit number
D= the identification of the circuit in multiple circuit applications, as in with multiple PRI's associated with the same telephone numbers.
E(E)= a one- or two-digit variable that is administered locally for various reasons.
For billing and tracking purposes, every circuit, even DSL riding on a voice line needs to have some kind of number associated with it so that it has a "name".
I have never actually gotten a definitive answer on this, so what I have said is just information gathered through experience in dealing with circuits. The circuit numbers assigned by CLECs or other carriers don't really seem to follow any standard format; it's the LEC's circuit that must follow a somewhat uniform standard under the CLI (Common Language Identifier) code.
We are in LATA 236, so here's an example of one of our BRI circuits here in our office:
posted
Ed's got the circuit ID. the 4 letters after the lata indicate what type of circuit. Here is a explanation of NCI codes from Qwest, it should be the same for all baby bells because of the bell standard. http://www.qwest.com/techpub/77203/77203.pdf
posted
Yikes, Bill! I think I could have read the entire Webster's dictonary in the time it would take to read that thing! No wonder we have to pay $8.50 per month for Caller ID.........It's to pay the people behind the scenes who are paid to write this stuff!
posted
Hey Ed I used to know how to decipher all that junk, now I'd need the book.
Jeff:: here is more than you asked for, all the voice grade service ID's and what they mean. The first two letters get you to the voice grade type and the second two to the specific service.
posted
According to what I could find, I am in LATA 320. I have seen circuits for t1's that are 24DHZA, 90HCGS, etc. Just wondering what the difference would be, possibly different COs?
-------------------- Jeff Moss Sole Proprietor Moss Communications "Your Residential Connection" Computer Repair-Networking-Cabling www.mosscomm.net MBSWWYPBX, JGAE Posts: 4973 | From: Beachwood and Toledo, OH | Registered: Dec 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Jeff: There are long haul carrier ID's AT&T, MCI and so on. AT&T was DHEC (usually) for a T1, so I assume your DHZA is another long haul carrier. The HCGS is the LEC. You should know they couldn't use the same numbering system, you should have seen the mess we had before we were allowed to cross reference LEC ID's with ours. Of course you had different LEC ID's for each end, even if it was the same LEC.
PS to further confuse the issue the term LATA is used for calling area's but is not the same area as area codes..now figure that one out.
-------------------- Located in the Nebraska Panhandle Posts: 10171 | From: Western Nebraska | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
I looked up online for the Cleveland area and I found LATA 320. The area code is 216. Thanks for the information. Jeff EDIT: looked up DHZA and found that it is SBC, along with HCGS. SBC is our telco here. (well now it's at&t)
-------------------- Jeff Moss Sole Proprietor Moss Communications "Your Residential Connection" Computer Repair-Networking-Cabling www.mosscomm.net MBSWWYPBX, JGAE Posts: 4973 | From: Beachwood and Toledo, OH | Registered: Dec 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
And before that it was Ameritech, and before that, it was Ohio Bell and before that............
Jeff, an old cable splicer friend of mine from Verizon, formerly Bell Atlantic, formerly C&P Telephone, formerly......... told me that the HCGS stood for "High Capacity Grade of Service". Maybe there is some rhyme or reason to these circuit ID's after all.
Yes, HiCap does mean high capacity, but in this day and age with telecommunications that can mean a lot of things. I think that terminology will soon fall by the wayside as technology improves. It will eventually become a joke like 28.8K "high speed" modems. Everyone will recognize the terminology, but the new terminology for the higher-speed circuit will make HCGS stand out like a sore thumb.
posted
We (AT&T) called the circuits between us and the LECs HiCaps, but I'm sure others use the same term. This thread of yours, Jeff, has made me do a lot of thinking and thanks to you I realize how much I've forgotten in a few short years of retirement from Ma Bell. About the only way you're going to find all the CLLI codes is to find someone who had the books, or maybe some internet searching, there are a bunch of them. I've been racking my brain trying to remember the LEC's ID for digital data and so far nothing.
EDIT:: Man you weren't looking for CLLI codes..See what's happening to me.
-------------------- Located in the Nebraska Panhandle Posts: 10171 | From: Western Nebraska | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
a txnu is a circuit ID for an unbundeled loop (pots line), it is provided from the lec to the clecs for non resold ckt's (meaning the clec has their own switch), for example if an enduser has att local pots service (non unep--resold)but the lec is say sbc. att cannot report a telephone number to the lec but must use the txnu info (as well as co handeoff inforamtion). for the most part the enduser or vendor should never need this informaton, it is more for the service proiveder. now for isdn or high cap service your t1 ckt id is the best way to report trouble to the local carrier,if you are lucky the smart jack or channel bank on site SHOULD (key word here) be labeled especially with all the automated systems local carriers are using they may accept a telephone number for a high cap ckt and route it to the wrong work center, this wil delay repair by a few hours.
-------------------- I Swear I did not touch anything Posts: 2543 | From: jersey | Registered: Dec 2005
| IP: Logged |
CnGRacin
Telephone Service, T1 Moderator
Member # 6218
posted
Im a LEC engineer Have worked for both SBC and now an Independent.
The LEC circuit IDs are based off Telcodias Common Language Coding We ALL have to play by these general rules. At one time there was intelligence built into the coding (i.e. HC= Hi-Capacity) but the complexity of the business no longer allows for it.
XX/YYYY/000000/111/CC/SEG Pre-fix/service code-service code modifier/serial #/suffix/company identifier/segment name
* Pre-fix= Will set by administration areas for each company they may or may not be based on LATA * Service Code= what type of service this circuit is providing * Service Code Modifier= Modifies the service code, often used for different billing options. * Serial Number= 6 digit numeric identifier * Suffix= if a service has multiple legs or drops this will further identify the location. (almost never used.) * Company identifier= Identifies the controlling LEC (SW= Southwestern Bell, GTEC= GTE, etc.) * Segment= the drop NAME for a multi point circuit. (not used much any more)
The service code tells ya what kind of circuit you have. Heres a list of the most common youll see: HC= 1.544 Mbs (T1) HX= Fractional T1. (Heres where a service code modifier is really used for the Frac. T1 rate.) IA= ISDN BRI access line IB= ISDN BRI non-access XH= 56 Kb DS0 XD= 64Kd DS0 FX= foreign exchange (Telephone numbered format.) TK= Two way trunk PD= Private Line Data PL= Private Line Voice LX= CLEC POTS LY= CLEC POTS (improved line conditioning)
There are OTHER codes that you may see such as NCI (network channel interface) codes that will help further describe the service.
NCI Codes describes the type and use at a terminating location NC (network chanell) codes will describe the circuit parameter through the LEC.
posted
CnGRacin: Could you explain the secondary NCI codes, I don't remember the whole thing and I think it will be helpful. Right now there is a lot of signaling questions as far as disconnect supervision. If I remember right all the secondary codes show is the wiring (2,4,6), and signaling (ls, gs, em etc) I do know on special circuits the conditioning and levels are in there also. Thanks for your input.
-------------------- Located in the Nebraska Panhandle Posts: 10171 | From: Western Nebraska | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged |
posted
Well, CnGRacin, race around this one! They might be working that way in the Midwest, but let me tell you that the local independent LEC and CLECs don't adhere to anything even close to that format!
Yes, our predominant LEC (Verizon-Bell Atlantic) does, but the local independent LEC (Verizon-GTE) isn't using anything close.
I sure would like to see a uniform circuit ID format, but it ain't happening around here.
It's great to see someone here working in your capacity to help us with these issues because let me tell you, getting support from the local exchange carriers or CLECs on simple issues like this one is impossible. We need more people with your credentials with knowledge levels above typical repair service or business office personnel, the general public's primary source of information.
posted
That's what made it so much fun Ed, the independents had their own numbering system, and they couldn't cross reference anything. We had many circuits that went Lec, independent back to lec, ya thinks it wasn't fun trying to get something fixed when the trouble was between the independent and the lec? That's the kinda of stuff I put up with my last 17 years. After all that you had to tell them how to fix their trouble!..Good ol days, NOT.
-------------------- Located in the Nebraska Panhandle Posts: 10171 | From: Western Nebraska | Registered: May 2002
| IP: Logged |
CnGRacin
Telephone Service, T1 Moderator
Member # 6218
* NN= (The first two digits) are the number of wire at the demark. 02= 2-wire interface, 04=4-wire interface. * LL= (The 2nd two alpha characters) will indicate Protocol. This gets into the nuts-n-bolts of describing the signal (digital, analog or DC-signaling) to be expected.
Here are some high-runner examples: CS= digital cross system DA= Analog at a data level (13 Db down) DC= DC current and/or voltage DS= Digital rated term for anything above 64 Kb DDS DU= Digital Unit (64 Kb DDS and below) DX= DX signaling E?= (EA, EB, or EC) E&M signaling GO= ground start OPEN end GS= Ground start CLOSED (station) end IS= ISDN BRI LO= Loops start OPEN end (switch) LS= Loop start CLOSED end (station) NO= No signaling at voice level (0-8 Db) RV= Reverse battery (trunks)
* n= Impudence code: Most used: 2= 600 ohm AC impedance 3= 900 ohm AC impedance 5= 135 ohm AC impedance 9= 100 ohm AC impedance
* XXX (between the slashes) are protocol options The can be used to modify or further explain the protocol. With up two three alpha numeric characters itd would be impossible for me to try to list many but here one example of how it would work 04DU5/56_/-- .The DU tells ya its a DS0 rate digital the 56 would further explain that the customer wants a 56 Kb circuit.
* xx= TLP (transmission level point) Used to specify (if needed) what Db level is expected at the demarc. 1st character towards the network 2nd character toward the station/customer.
If you have a specific code youd like to know what it means, let me know Id be happy to decode it for ya!
posted
EV607797, Well I dont think a LEC can use a different format. You may see some ckt ids that are not even close to what I describe from Inter-exchange companies, interconnect providers and even some CLECs. Those will also be listed on demarc tags and if youd call say VZ and try to give them say a Sprint ckt id (8 numeric characters only) theyre not going to be able to cross-reference it at all Believe me, we have that SAME problem on this side of the demarc at times too.
As far as standardization goes Bout 4 years ago Telcordia (once was Bell-Core, now the GODs of Common Language coding) started a process to get all LECs RBOC or independents on the same page with our own dialects of telephone-ese. There are still homegrown coding with each company BUT that has been going away little by little over time.
posted
Note to CnGRacin - do you have any kind of list that details the circuit id modifiers? I am working with all types of circuits (primarily ATM and frame relay) and would sure appreciate any list that tells me what type they are.
thanks,
Posts: 1 | From: San Antonio Texas | Registered: Jul 2006
| IP: Logged |
CnGRacin
Telephone Service, T1 Moderator
Member # 6218
quote:Originally posted by maria l: Note to CnGRacin - do you have any kind of list that details the circuit id modifiers? I am working with all types of circuits (primarily ATM and frame relay) and would sure appreciate any list that tells me what type they are.
thanks,
No, I’m sorry I do not have a comprehensive list of those available. I did have a list at one time BUT they are listed out by circuit id service codes (3rd and 4th character) so, there was literally hundreds of pages. The service code modifiers (5th and 6th position) of the circuit ID mostly are used to identify billing info and things like % LATA usage. Not things I’m concerned with usually when engineering a circuit.
I’ll take a look around the office and see if I can find something that may help ya out… There’s some Telcordia Common Language stuff here that no one looks at… Maybe I can find something that you could use… BUT like I said the publication I was used in the past was formatted by every type of ckt id.
Also, let me ask this. Is “circuit id modifiers” really what you’re looking for? Take a circuit id like 27/XHGS/######/SW. “XH” indicates it’s a 56 Kb DDS. You want to be able to look up what the “G” and the “S” mean?
posted
You'll get better answers in the "telephone service" area further down on this forum.
-------------------- Joe --- No trees were harmed as a result of this posting; however, many electrons were severely inconvenienced. Posts: 1407 | From: Van Buren, AR USA | Registered: Sep 2004
| IP: Logged |
CnGRacin
Telephone Service, T1 Moderator
Member # 6218
posted
Hey, found somethin' for ya... but like I said it's service code dependant. Here's the modifiers from fractional Frame Relay services:
QB FRAME RELAY - 512 KB 15-104 11E Table 15-57 BLOCK 11E Modifiers Modifier Definition XE Customer reconfigurable. XQ LAN. XR Service restoration. XS Customer/provider interface. XU ONA/unbundled. XX No further parameters required. XZ Official company service (for internal use only - not to be passed between trading partners). YE Interstate jurisdiction: Customer reconfigurable. YQ Interstate jurisdiction: LAN. YR Interstate jurisdiction: Service restoration. YS Interstate jurisdiction: Customer/provider interface. YU Interstate jurisdiction: ONA/unbundled. YX Interstate jurisdiction. YZ Interstate jurisdiction: Official company service (for internal use only - not to be passed between trading partners).
You may want to do an internal company search or internet search or BellCore Reference # BR-792-402-100. The version I have is 499 pages long.
posted
Wow, and I thought that I was smart by figuring out the fact that the first two digits of the circuit ID were the last two digits of the LATA. I knew about the XHGS being a T1 (a Verizon friend of mine told me this meant "extra high grade of service"). I believed him. I suppose we never stop learning.
-------------------- If it ain't broke, I haven't fixed it yet. (NATU66B) Posts: 2712 | From: Arlington Massachusetts | Registered: Dec 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
Here are a few more types of circuit IDs people may or may not be familiar with:
1) 95/XHGS/123456/NE
2) 95/LGGS/123456/NE
The first ID represents a stand-alone digital DS0 say 56k or 64k.
The second represents a stand-alone analog DS0 type of circuit. Used to see a lot of these, but they are pretty rare now.
-------------------- If it ain't broke, I haven't fixed it yet. (NATU66B) Posts: 2712 | From: Arlington Massachusetts | Registered: Dec 2005
| IP: Logged |
CnGRacin
Telephone Service, T1 Moderator
Member # 6218
quote:Originally posted by dexman: Here are a few more types of circuit IDs people may or may not be familiar with:
1) 95/XHGS/123456/NE
2) 95/LGGS/123456/NE
The first ID represents a stand-alone digital DS0 say 56k or 64k.
The second represents a stand-alone analog DS0 type of circuit. Used to see a lot of these, but they are pretty rare now.
XH=56 Kb DDS XD=64 Kb DDS Both for ID’s are for access circuits... Meaning there’s an IXC (LD carrier) involved. Non-Access (within one LATA) has an entirely different set of service codes.
One more format most ya’ll will see that wasn't mentioned in this thread: The good ol’ telephone number format.
Prefix/service code+modifier/NPA/NXX/line number/extension or trunk/segment
Prefix= Admin Area or Market Area designator Service Code= Two characters representing the type of service Modifier= provides additional info for the service code including % Lata usage and billing NPA= Area code NXX= C.O. code or exchange ID Line Number= well, that’s the number of the line Extension= Got me… Never seen that used before Trunk Code= The sequential number of the trunk in the trunk group Segment= Drop identifier for multi-point circuits
Example for an OPX circuit: 01/OPNA/111/555/8750//002
01=Market Area OP= Off-premise extension NA= inter-lata with no other parameter needed 111= Area Code 555=Exchange 8750=Phone number “//” No extension or trunk code present 002= Drop two of a multi point OPX
There’s also a message trunk ID that is used to move calls, signaling information between switches:
Trunk number / traffic class (2 characters) – Office class (2 characters) Traffic use (2 characters) Trunk Type modifier /A-end CILLI / signaling code / Z-end CILLI
0001/PH55TEKEWUA/OFLNMOXAAMD/77/OFLNMOXADS0
First trunk (0001) that for two-way SS7 trunks (I’m not even going to try to ‘splain it any more than that… They usually confuse the crap out of me too.)
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
Printer-friendly view of this topic
![[help]](graemlins/help.gif)
About the only way you're going to find all the CLLI codes is to find someone who had the books, or maybe some internet searching, there are a bunch of them. I've been racking my brain trying to remember the LEC's ID for digital data and so far nothing. ![[Shrug]](graemlins/dontknow.gif)
![[Scratch Head]](graemlins/eusa_doh.gif)
![[Bang]](graemlins/BangHead.gif)
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[toast]](graemlins/occasion14.gif)
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
